CAD software discussion forum > Other CAD/CAM Technology > Linux? / Multithreaded? / 64-bit ? / When?

Linux? / Multithreaded? / 64-bit ? / When?

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james

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Message 1 of 28

 Linux? / Multithreaded? / 64-bit ? / When?
26-12-2006 10:17 . am | View his/her posts only
With the highend pc systems, and gpus available at reasonable prices, when can we expect to see VX step up to the plate?

Linux is extremely powerful, stable, and free. I have used Suse and Ubuntu with great desktop sucess.
The only reason I use windows is because I have to. Do a search, there are not a lot of CAD/CAM options
for the linux platform. Definitely nothing as nice as VX. And I cannot afford something like Catia on a
top notch unix system.

Multicore/Multithreading is the only direction now. Hell, my laptop is dualcore with 2gig ram.
Autodesk, and others, are either there or getting there. Don't fall behind. Take a leap forward.

Also, lets kick the ease of customization up a little bit.

Must of us running CAD/CAM software are geeks. Face it. We love to build, design, and use our imaginations.
Help us to continue to do it with VX. Give us the power.

Thanks for letting me digress.

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Steve

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Registered: 2004-10-9

Message 2 of 28

26-12-2006 11:52 . am | View his/her posts only
I'd rather see 'em make a native Macintosh OS X build... But that's just me.

The problem with small Cad/Cam companies such as VX, is support. Supporting multiple OSes isn't exactly an easy thing to do.

You can see that VXs roots are from the Unix world, and I don't think it would be impossible for them to port it over to Linux. But that opens a whole big can 'o worms IMHO.

For example, video card support just isn't what it should be in the multiple distros. I've got a socket 939, Athlon 64 3700+ box I built a while back with Ubuntu on it. The commercial Nvidia Linux drivers REFUSE to work with my 7800GTX graphics card. The opensource drivers don't work all that hot either.

And I could be mistaken, but I thought that at least Quickmill part of VX was multi-threaded.

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 3 of 28

27-12-2006 07:13 . am | View his/her posts only
There is a technological revolution going on in the CPU world, and a team-up of GPU manufacturers with CPU manufacturers. I just hope it does not end up being a BetaMax vs VHS kind of thing, which for us consumers would be bad if it resulted in one side bowing out of the market (which has always happened before, graphics chip wise, unfortunately).





VX already does multi-thread where doing so is an advantage to the User. However, this technology has always been too hyped-up and has generally been a crafty method to make you think everything is faster when multi-tasking. Often the reverse is true because the technology has been applied to an inappropriate case. Multi-core on the other hand is clearly going to deliver. The software does not have to be "multi-core ready" or "compatible" either - you will be able to dedicate a single core to your currently most busy program! Everything is handled by the processor and the OS. This is where Windows Vista (though currently presenting problems to most CAD-CAM software with regards to the poor support of OpenGL), could again pull-away from it's competitors. It is very likely that Apple will at sometime in the future (very near future maybe?) drop their OS and just support Windows - concentrating on the hardware goodies that really bring in their money.





Linux has been around a long time now and we have always had the capability to offer VX on that platform, but where is Linux going? Most commercial operations have not expressed a need for CAD-CAM on Linux, they are happy on Windows. Looking back to the "old days", when most CAD-CAM was only on Unix, there was huge commercial pressure to develop for Windows, so the market was very clear about what it wanted - there has been nothing like this market interest in Linux.





From a VX development perspective, all we can do is rub our hands together in glee, because the meteoric improvement in the PC platform offers great potential - not just raw speed but the capability to handle more complex commands (demands?) in real time. However, we will be wise to wait for the dust to settle a bit, since all of the new platform technologies currently have a rash of little problems.




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Steve

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Message 4 of 28

27-12-2006 08:40 . am | View his/her posts only
Quote

It is very likely that Apple will at sometime in the future (very near future maybe?) drop their OS and just support Windows - concentrating on the hardware goodies that really bring in their money.


Ain't gonna happen...

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 5 of 28

28-12-2006 07:29 . am | View his/her posts only
Apple only run Windows? You must be joking! That would slash the stock price immediately and relegate Apple to another PC box maker like Dell. I use both Apple and Windows (Dell) hardware and have done so for the last 16 years. Productivity wise the Apple kit and systems far exceed the Windows only stuff. In my next round of hardware upgrades I'm dropping the PC hardware and switching to Apple only, and installing Windows and Mac OSX.

I'm not a die hard Apple fan. I look at the bottom line and return on investment. All I can say is that in my experience I get practically no issues on Mac and loads of issues on Windows.

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Steve

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Message 6 of 28

28-12-2006 04:04 . pm | View his/her posts only
3D Monkey, just don't get ANY of the Macs with the ATI graphics chipset. Sketching on VX with the Radeon X1600 PRO is frustrating. ATI does some sort of "smoothing" that screws with sketching slowing it to a friggin' crawl. For example, when you creat a sketch, and insert a circle. moving it around the screen takes a few seconds for the cursor to catch up. Same thing in sheets, and doing any dimensioning. It's frustrating. And I can't seem to find a way to disable the "smoothing" that ATI does.

The new 24" iMac is going in the right direction using a Nvidia 7300 chipset, that supposedly is replaceable/upgradable using the NVidia MXM interface. You can upgrade to the 7600GT/256 meg at time of purchase as well. I'm *ALMOST* tempted to get one for home use But can't justify it, after recently picking up a 17" imac.

But Chris, OSX isn't going to go away

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 7 of 28

29-12-2006 07:01 . am | View his/her posts only
Steve I agree...all my Macs have Nvidia cards. ATI are crap (technical term that). Hopefully Apple will move to the Nvidia graphics cards for laptops as well...like Dell. Never had any problems with that card.

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 8 of 28

29-12-2006 11:31 . am | View his/her posts only
Hi all

...on the contrary, since Apple have provisioned for WindowsXP on their boxes, sales have boosted. Offering an OS choice of MAC X and Windows Vista is the next step, and I think that'll turn out to be the nail in the coffin..............

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 9 of 28

29-12-2006 01:19 . pm | View his/her posts only
We'll agree to differ Chris :-)

I'm working with a marketing vice president at Apple right now and sales have gone up for sure but not for running windows on. CAD is a tiny tiny percentage of the market for Apple and others

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Steve

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Message 10 of 28

29-12-2006 01:30 . pm | View his/her posts only
Chris just hasn't had the chance to experience the true elegance of OSX
Think about it... It's as robust, stable and secure as Linux & BSD, with the ease of use of Windows.

Just port VX over to OSX... And they will come
You than have a niche... The only true, seamless Cad/Cam package for OSX

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 11 of 28

29-12-2006 04:08 . pm | View his/her posts only
Well, I might be mad, but then I'm not the only mad man

http://www.boston.com/business/technology/articles/2006/04/06/apple_will_allow_windows_to_run_on_machines/


......they'll be making the X Box next!



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OldForumPost

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Registered: 2012-1-14

Message 12 of 28

30-12-2006 02:44 . am | View his/her posts only
There's more than two madmen out there:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1927885,00.asp

I heard Dvorak talking about this a few months ago on the "This Week in Tech" podcast - worth a listen if you want to keep up with technology developments Stateside, although everyone will know you're a geek

There's no doubt that dropping OS X would infuriate most Apple fans, but would they stop buying them? I'd have thought that the damage to Apple's brand done by dropping the OS would be too great for Steve Jobs to consider it.

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 13 of 28

30-12-2006 11:39 . am | View his/her posts only
Guys guys lets not turn this into a Windows vs Mac thing :-)

Just face the facts.... Steve and I are right :-)

Happy New Year!

PS. The irony is I opted for SolidWorks over VX back in 1996 as VX was Unix only and the total seat cost was something like

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Steve

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Message 14 of 28

03-01-2007 12:10 . am | View his/her posts only
Owen, yes, I'm a twit fan. But Dvorak is a moron

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Steve

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Registered: 2004-10-9

Message 15 of 28

12-01-2007 06:54 . am | View his/her posts only
Quote

There is a technological revolution going on in the CPU world


Um, that's an understatement

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36902

So when did you say VX is going to become multi-threaded?

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 16 of 28

12-01-2007 08:38 . am | View his/her posts only
...we are going to synch it with the time that Apple moves over to Windows Vista

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 17 of 28

12-01-2007 10:50 . am | View his/her posts only


Now thats funny Chris :-D

Once all those iPhones get out there people can really see the benfits of the Apple platform :-)

Me, I'll just run VX on my new Apple twin quad Mac running Windows XP......

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warren

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Registered: 2004-10-28

Message 18 of 28

23-08-2007 05:43 . pm | View his/her posts only
In response to LINUX being free...

The least of my expenses to worry about in my CAD CAM business is the cost of my OS. The least expensive of my investments is the OS so the $300 or so I would save by a free LINUX installation just doesn't make sense with the headaches associated with the lack of dedicated support. By the time I add up all my software alone I'm in the $20,000 range and another $4000 for computer equipment and a $1500 graphics card.

LINUX is good for what it was designed to so, 'serve.' Set up your server with LINUX and save the cost of "Windows Server" but don't worry about the cost of MS Windows XP (and Vista when it's ready) to run your high end CAD CAM.

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Steve

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Message 19 of 28

04-10-2007 12:26 . pm | View his/her posts only
Now, another thought..... Has anyone tried to install/use VX under Wine?

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Kevin

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Registered: 2004-4-26

Message 20 of 28

05-10-2007 04:51 . am | View his/her posts only
Under the influence of wine - yes - many times. Indeed it dould be said VX has driven me to install many modules of wine on many occasions

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Mark

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posts: 80

Registered: 2011-7-11

Message 21 of 28

05-10-2007 05:54 . am | View his/her posts only
Hello Chris, how can you force a core to "you will be able to dedicate a single core to your currently most busy program! " is this possible now?

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Steve

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Message 22 of 28

05-10-2007 10:39 . am | View his/her posts only
Yes, it's possible, and easy...
Do a CTRL-ALT-DELETE to bring up the task manager. Click on the Processes tab. Right click on vxmaine.exe and click on 'set affinity', and now choose which processor core to use.

Easy, no?


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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 23 of 28

08-10-2007 04:36 . am | View his/her posts only

It is easy, but what is a pain is that VX will only get the core to itself if you re-direct all the other running software to the other core (cores) and there is no way to store your choice, so if you restart the PC you have to do it all over again. Plus, Microsoft doesn't respect your selections and allows operating system services to trample all over them. I expected these niggles to be sorted out in Vista, but currently there are other Vista problems that demand more attention. I'm sure they will get there eventually.

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Mark

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Registered: 2011-7-11

Message 24 of 28

09-10-2007 11:31 . am | View his/her posts only
Chris, Have you any tips for setting up the 'configuration' display settings for improvements and / or Nvidia graphics settings in the display properties.

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 25 of 28

09-10-2007 09:52 . pm | View his/her posts only

Well, I think of greatest concern with the 2007 spec will be how to slow it down

If we are seeking speed improvements, ensure that your data files are on a separate hard drive to the OS. For those that may have recently upgraded to new hard drives, you could re-use one of your old drives and dedicate it to the pagefile.

There is not much to change in VX config, but on the Display tab, try reducing the curve display tolerance to 1.0 (default is 2.0).

For the graphics card, Display Properties, Settings tab, Advanced, ensure the screen refresh rate is at the highest supported setting. Appearance tab, Effects, switch off "show shadows under menus" and "show window contents while dragging" for faster performance. Select ClearType screen fonts method to make the screen easier to read (fonts are less "blocky"). The default nVidia settings are working well on my PC. VX is using OpenGL. The nVidia settings are essentially a choice between speed and image quality. Your FX4600 card can deliver both.

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Mark

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Registered: 2011-7-11

Message 26 of 28

27-11-2007 09:27 . am | View his/her posts only
I am now running on X64 bit XP.

Biggest gripe is after running through a reged and then saying 'undo' even one step, the system halts for 10-20 seconds. Its a real pain.

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ChrisWard2k2

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Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 27 of 28

27-11-2007 10:21 . am | View his/her posts only
We haven't compiled VX to run on a 64bit machine, Windows is running VX at 32bit and perhaps that is System overhead you are experiencing. It might be the case, if you are using a dongle, that your dongle driver is incorrect for X64. That could slow-down VX when it performs a license check. However, I note that Aladdin have a harsh disclaimer for 64bit :When using DataHASP protection on an x64 operating system, and using an anti-virus application, data may be lost


Aladdin HASP

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Mark

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Registered: 2011-7-11

Message 28 of 28

27-11-2007 10:28 . am | View his/her posts only
No, not on a dongle, and when last offered a hardware upgrade for VX where offering XP 64bit.

See also