CAD/CAM discussion forum > 3D CAD/CAM > Why does VX core?

Why does VX core?

Rank: 7Rank: 7Rank: 7

Paul

Moderator

posts: 326

Registered: 2011-9-17

Message 1 of 9

 Why does VX core?
20-04-2008 06:20 . pm | View his/her posts only
I would like to know why VX cores? Of all the programs I use, it is the only one that vamooshes/cores/vanishes of the face of the screen.
Most other programs, if they do, hang, freeze, report error messages etc. and then you have to deal with them via Task Manager. I know VX does that sometime too, but coring???

Note: This is not a bug report, just a question to help me understand.
Cheers

Rank: 1

ChrisWard2k2

Newbie

posts: 2

Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 2 of 9

21-04-2008 05:10 . am | View his/her posts only

Hello Mudcrab

All software cores (crashes) because all software has imperfections. If the software no longer responds, be it a hang, freeze or disappearance, that is a core - really doesn't matter if it "falls" off screen or you have to kill it via Task Manager, it has become unusable.

There are a multitude of reasons why software can core, in the same way that there are a multitude of reasons why an aircraft might crash (maybe it's software might core.....). We know some of the reasons with the benefit of hindsight - for example, the design did not take into consideration something a User could and would do. Douglas Adams, 1952-2001, said "A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to under estimate the ingenuity of complete fools". So, some cores are due to bugs in the software itself - we have made a mistake in our code.

It mostly is not that simple though. The Operating System is very complex and thus imperfect, ditto the hardware. Very large, sophisticated programs like CAD-CAM are the most likely to fall foul of system defects because they leverage every available resource from them. So, it is often a combination of things that finally result in a core.

Something that Windows can often fail to deal with is an errant small program, such as a device driver, which by it's very nature can become a burden to the whole system, but of course the biggest application (your CAD program) is the one that suffers most. A good example of that is the Microsoft "Life Cam" Web Cam driver "vx3000" (nothing to do with VX Corp), which is somewhat infamous. Somehow, that driver causes a small percentage of systems to hang, yet most others are fine. I think we can all understand Microsoft's predicament - the PC as we know it today comes along in thousands of variations in terms of the hardware components -that becomes hundreds of thousands of variations when you include the software.

Some "freebie" software is excellent, but some can inadvertently "break the system rules" and typically that manifests in the program using an area of memory that is already occupied, perhaps by Windows or VX. This type of thing can cause the "surprise!" core when your application just vanishes from screen - but similarly, that can be a RAM stick suddenly failing (perhaps because there is just a small region of it that was faulty at time of manufacture, or it has been overheated, or it is not 100% compatible with other hardware components/BIOS, or it has not been seated correctly). A lot of people think that RAM failure will always produce a BSOD (Blue Screen of Death), but that is not so, it can be much more subtle, which is worst because it is more difficult to isolate as a cause of failure. My message here is to avoid installing things that you really don't need, both software and hardware. Custom mouse cursors for example look great and seem to be innocent but they are notorious for being the cause of big problems.

Last but certainly not least are viruses and spyware. Don't underestimate the damage that spyware can do to your system, it may not be deliberately malicious but it is possible for it to cause more disruption than a virus. However, even your anti-virus software can be a cause as well as a cure! Typically, if an anti-virus system detects "unusual file behaviour", it will try to search these files for a virus. VX is not one single executable program - if your anti-virus "thinks" that VX's launching of one or more other exe files requires examination, the actual examination of the file can core the parent program (VX). So, it is important to add all the programs you installed to the anti-virus "white list", if it has one.

In conclusion, there is not a time in the foreseeable future when it will be wise to discard your faithful abacus

Rank: 1

Robert

Newbie

posts: 0

Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 3 of 9

21-04-2008 08:42 . am | View his/her posts only
Hi Paul,

Can you give us a hint of what you might have been doing when the software cored?

Help us to narrow it down a little.

thanks,

Rank: 7Rank: 7Rank: 7

Paul

Moderator

posts: 326

Registered: 2011-9-17

Message 4 of 9

21-04-2008 04:05 . pm | View his/her posts only
Hi Bob,
the question was not in response to any particular problem.
If I have a problem I will normally try and send it through with an example if I can reproduce one . Occassionally I get really frustrated and just need to vent!
I was really interested in why the vanish, which I have only experinced with VX.
Chris'a answer brings back the reallity/complexity of the PC evolution, who the creators are etc. THE REAL WORLD
In most regards, when VX vanishes, it is probalby much more convenient than a freeze, as it's gone, no question, and either restart or reboot will get it sorted.
The funny thing is, on Friday afternoon, final rush to send something out, I did a save and VX froze at 99%. I was forced to power down as after 1/2hr (cup of tea, feed the pet pig etc.)no change.
On reboot, no Windows. Long story -short, the BIOS had gotten confused about which drive to boot from and was ignoring the correct drive entirely. Took me a while to figure that out tho. Then I discovered the 'saved' file was reduced from 315Mb to 2! Fortunately I have just done a local backup 20 minutes before so it was sweet and all happy now.
However in light of this I am now planning on adding another drive and running Raid1 AND doing the Windows Auto Recovery set up.
FYI. The most likely 'core' problem I see is during Merge. Sometimes it does, sometime it doesn't, depends on the clouds.
Roll on V13.55

Cheers

Rank: 1

cutter

Newbie

posts: 56

Registered: 2011-11-23

Message 5 of 9

28-04-2008 07:44 . am | View his/her posts only
Hi all, this has been an issue with me to and the hard part about figuring out exactly what you were doing that caused it is this. You know what you were doing but there are a number of variables going into each operation and VX does not give you a count down notice so that you can record all your parameters. It just goes away instantly. I dont know how they do it in Surfcam, and there is a huge difference between the two as Surfcam is cam only but when it cores and you restart it it will take you back to the point just prior to the crash. My problems with VX coring have been with cad. I don't know how you isolate something like this with all the various programs we have running in the backround and I am sure that if we took all the workstations in the world that had VX on them there would be no two set up exactly the same. Unless I was really lucky and had managed to hit save as the last command before the one that caused the core I guess I could have some clues as to what really caused it but I have not been that lucky yet. Normally I just lose some of my time with no understanding of why and have just learned to live with it.

Rank: 1

ChrisWard2k2

Newbie

posts: 2

Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 6 of 9

28-04-2008 09:01 . am | View his/her posts only
Hi cutter

In v13.x, VX attempts to save a backup of the file. If VX cores again, go to your VX User Folder and you will hopefully find a folder named "EmergencyBackup001". There could be more than one of these if the core repeats. There is no guarantee that the saved file is going to be good, but it might be.

Other important tips:

Perform a regular backup of your files, at least daily, to a separate detachable drive or to writable media (CD, DVD). If you have a detachable drive (e.g. USB connected hard drive), detach it!

Regularly defragment your hard drives, at least weekly.

Rank: 7Rank: 7Rank: 7

Paul

Moderator

posts: 326

Registered: 2011-9-17

Message 7 of 9

28-04-2008 11:46 . pm | View his/her posts only
Hi Bob,
I've been watching carefully since this thread started.
Here are the typical activities I have crash problems in:
Saving files - can hang and hang and ... at 100% CPU usage. ( A core is MUCH cleaner...! did I say that?)
2D Doing section views of assemblies - when I'm deleting a view and start redoing is risky - gone
Making alignment changes in an largish assembly. - Uhoh, nothings happening...

Very hard to be specific. All my files span at least one version, currently more. e. g come parts are from V10.9+

I know it doesn't help you, but reliablity is, IMHO, more important than features (until you need them).

Cheers

Rank: 1

cutter

Newbie

posts: 56

Registered: 2011-11-23

Message 8 of 9

01-05-2008 08:00 . am | View his/her posts only
Hi Chris, I will try that one and see next time. Bought a new computer a couple of years ago and lost the hard drive after 4 days of use. I had been in the habit of archiving all parts files so other than the agravation of the whole thing no critical work was lost. SDon't do daily backups but do them when a certain amount of work done accumulates as I dont want to be another horror story. It's amazing to me how many companies I work with do not haave redundant archives of their important stuff.

Rank: 1

ChrisWard2k2

Newbie

posts: 2

Registered: 2011-11-22

Message 9 of 9

01-05-2008 10:09 . am | View his/her posts only

Hello cutter

I think you are still taking a risk there. A daily back-up should be the minimum, it can be automated, and it is low cost. Customers elsewhere on the forum recommended SynchBackSE http://www.2brightsparks.com, I use it too - easy set-up. There are many other similar programs available.
See also